Landy Peek (00:36)
There's a kind of clutter that isn't just in our closets, it's in our bodies. It's the weight of unfinished decisions, the shame of what we hide, and the nervous system bracing. We live in without noticing. Today I'm sitting down with Dorota Coldo, a decluttering coach who doesn't start with bins and labels, she starts with biology and compassion. She helps women create calmer homes and life spaces.
by expanding nervous system capacity so change feels safe and lasts. If you've ever opened a garage door, felt your heart spike and shut it again, this conversation will meet you with zero judgment and a lot of relief. We're talking micro steps, releasing people pleasing through simple choices and why trash first can be profoundly kind to begin with.
I am so excited for you to hear this conversation. It literally changed my life as we went for a full garage that we couldn't even get a car in to a cleaned and organized space in our garage where we can get a car in. And my husband now has a shop. So...
I hope you take as many nuggets as I took from this incredible conversation.
Let's dive in.
Speaker 1 (01:55)
am so thrilled for today's guest, Dorota Coldo. Welcome to the Landy Peak Podcast. Can you tell the audience a little bit about yourself so we can start to get to know you?
Speaker 2 (02:06)
Thank you so much for having me. I'm just so grateful to be here. Yeah. So, my gosh, I'm a decluttering coach. So my mission in life is to help women declutter their spaces, but not in a way that you would expect. My main sort of, I can maybe call it a tool is nervous system regulation. Without this decluttering becomes
like this very hard masculine, do, do, do hassle kind of thing. Right. And I zero away from this and, I got into decluttering because my whole entire life, actually, I was sort of living in those two stages, either super nice and clean and organized, but that would only like last for a week, maybe. And then my home would like go back into the mess. Right. And not only in my adult life, but even, you know, a teenager or
you know, even younger than that, I remember always cherishing that moment of like, my gosh, this is so nice. Like this room is so nice. Right. And then in 2020 pandemic happened and I had to get another job. And side note here is at that time when I was like in the worst of my clutter, I actually run a cleaning business, very successful cleaning business. So for me, shame.
of having this huge secret was like triple. Like it was really messing with my head. And I reached my enough moment and I decided to get rid of the stuff and sort of fast forward to today. I'm helping women also become clutter free.
Speaker 1 (03:48)
I love that. And I love that, yes, I need help getting clutter free because there are areas of my life that are in complete chaos and clutter. But I love how you touched on the shame that goes with how we're working and putting ourselves out in the world and what we're feeling like we need to hide on our interpersonal side because they resonate so deeply with a lot of people.
In that, as I'm background occupational therapist and women's pelvic health therapist, so many of the therapists I know are struggling with their own pelvic health issues, but they're out there serving people and going, my gosh, like I've got to keep it hidden that I leak. And you know, when I jump on the trampoline, but I'm trying to help other people do it. And it's just in these healthcare professions that we're kind of hiding and struggling with the same things we're serving.
Speaker 2 (04:34)
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (04:40)
It's happening in a lot more areas and you're one that gets to share about that.
Speaker 2 (04:46)
Yeah, I know, you know, it's crazy. Like it's, there was this old saying and we have in Poland that, know, basically the long story short of the saying, I don't know really how to like translate it. I don't think I remember the whole like thing, but it's basically like, if you're doing the thing for other people, you're more often than not, are not doing that thing for yourself, right? Because we put out so much energy towards other people that
isn't much left for us and if we don't actively take steps towards caring about ourselves, it's just easier, easier, quote unquote, easier because it's not. Right? So definitely, know, the shame and stigma is there for sure.
Speaker 1 (05:32)
I'm so curious as you wove in in your beginning around the nervous system and how you use nervous system work to help us with declutter because I have also been one where I have gone through and like very clean house and I grew up in house that was very clean and organized. I struggle to keep it that way. That's the first thing that clutter starts coming in as I get stressed and then it increases my stress.
And then it's this big cycle and trying to get that clutter down, but it's more hiding it than actually doing anything with it because it just seems overwhelming to like really go through things.
Speaker 2 (06:13)
Yeah, my gosh, it does, you and you touched on so many amazing things here. But, you know, definitely like I also grew up in a home, like I moved back with my parents recently and my mom is like a cleaning freak, right? Like my dad would leave his jumper on like draped across the chair and she would go like, he's so messy. And I'm like, it's a jumper, right? It's not like 20 jumpers, right? But but we've
Because we grew, I think because we grew up around such a high standard, but we haven't really been taught how to deal with stuff, right? How to generally take care of and how to keep the things that matches our personality, not our moms or our caregivers. So there is a lot that goes into there, but you know, for sure it's one of those things where with the nervous system regulation, right?
Well, I love that actually on side note here, I love that nervous system is this like huge buzzword at the moment, right? Because we are just learning it. We should have like known that like our mothers or their mothers, you know, but they should have like taught or should have obviously like, you know, but, I love that this is like a big thing now. So the way I approach nervous system regulation is.
like the simplest way you can possibly imagine and actually looking at it from the perspective of our biology. right. So why, why nervous system? Like what is that nervous system? Right. It's like people think, okay, nervous system is I need to go and do like a cold plant, right. I fought 4 a.m. which is actually probably opposite to most women to do that. It's more dysregulating, but the nervous system job
just like in the most simple way is to protect us, right? If we think about when was it like sort of invented, developed, whatever, like however you want to say it. Like I tried to always explain it in like the most simple language. So back in like 2 million years ago or 20 million years ago, I don't know, I'm not good with numbers, when we still lived in caves, the safe,
environment for us was only inside the cave, right? And everything outside of the cave was a potential danger. But at that time, those like 2 million years ago, it wasn't like a potential, maybe danger, but it was very real, dangerous, you know, either a saber-toothed tiger was chasing us or we didn't have enough food or water or shelter, right? So our sort of body, right?
the God has given us the nervous system to sound the alarm through how our body responds to the stimuli to keep us safe. Right? So we still have actually all those years later, we'll still have at the back of our skull here at the very bottom, we have this tiny, tiny portion of the brain called reptilian brain, which is responsible for those primal ways that we cope with things.
And right now, fast forward to today, our cave became everything that we know. So clutter is known, is that some people call it comfort zone. Some people call it familiar zone. It's basically everything that we know to be true. Whether we are happy or not, it doesn't matter, right? It's just what we know. Everything outside of it is where the nervous system
Speaker 1 (09:31)
Right?
Speaker 2 (09:52)
If not regulated, if not expanded in a proper way, it's going to sound the alarms and it's literally going to go like, ah, what are you trying to do? Like you didn't ask me. No, no, no, we're not doing that. Freeze, fight, flight, phone is going to happen. So that's how I approach this topic.
Speaker 1 (10:13)
It's so fascinating as you're really applying. So nervous system work is my love. I work with my clients, but I'm looking at it in a slightly different way where you're looking at it. Here is our environment, which definitely impacts our nervous system and how our cave and our home are really that similar. We're creating that safety, but we could buy creating what we know and what we know may be that clutter.
Speaker 2 (10:41)
Yeah. And even if we hate it, even if it makes us depressed, it doesn't matter. It's all about, this is what I know. This is what I'm familiar with. And if I want to change it, my job now is to expand the capacity of my nervous system to feel okay and not to panic, not to go into override when I want to do something new. Right? So that's how I teach it.
Speaker 1 (11:10)
Yes, very similar, but not looking at the clutter in my garage because you can't get into my garage right now. So it's looking at that has as we have moved houses and my husband and I have moved all across the United States. We always end up with a garage full of despite that we might start with a clean garage. It always ends up. That's the familiarity.
Speaker 2 (11:36)
Yeah, that's what you know. whether you are actually consciously aware of this or not, because our nervous system is directly linked to our subconscious mind, So you will do, because that's what's familiar, that's what you know, the garage full of stuff, right? So eventually over time, and I bet that the next change of the house, the next time you move it, probably the garage is going to get filled up even faster.
even faster, even faster, right?
Speaker 1 (12:07)
Yes, that's what happened in the house. I got rid of so much stuff when we moved and all of a sudden we have more and more and more and it's, yes, it came very, I'm so excited to dive into this to help me clean the garage. So when we're looking kind of next steps, you talked about how you were in this space where you were probably the highest clutter that you had had in your house.
Speaker 2 (12:19)
It's right? It's a sneaky...
Speaker 1 (12:37)
I'm also in a space where it's probably one of the highest clutters and I blame it on family. I have kids and a husband and it's like, if I could just be by myself, I could clear out the clutter. It's all their stuff. Not always true, but that's the story. What do we do? How do we start addressing it? Because every time I go and I open the door to the garage and I have to go in there, it's like, I number one, need to clean this.
Speaker 2 (12:49)
That's the story, yes.
Speaker 1 (13:02)
Number two, feel the guilt that I haven't and embarrassment anytime we have to show anybody our garage. And it always gets put down the list of like, it's just too overwhelming. I just don't have time right now. We start to make a shift in a small way that doesn't freak out our nervous system and go, ⁓ this isn't safe. Can't do it. Shut the door. Ignore it.
Speaker 2 (13:14)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. So, you know, that's the thing that we have to start with nervous system. And the first, first thing that we really have to realize that this is what's happening. So that awareness piece is rather than sort of like ignoring that, you know, I have, I don't have the ability to deal with this because of some like unknown magical thing that is just like,
you know, making me freeze and panic and like my chest, you know, my heart is going to explode from my chest. Like, no, this is your nervous system reacting to that situation. Okay. You know that, okay, let's chill. Right. So what we can do actually is when you open that door, right. Calm yourself down, right. Because I bet like if you like hooked some monitors or whatever, like your heart rate would probably spike really fast. The anxiety builds up. That's why you shut the door. want to like.
runaway, right? So what I like to, the way I like to approach this is the same way, again, biology, right? If you are being chased by this saber-toothed tiger, right, imaginary, then what happens is in the dangerous situation, our heart beats faster, our breath shortens, right? So we can really quickly, hug back this, this reaction when we just
Calm down the breathing, calm down the beating heart. So let you just put your hand on your heart or don't like whatever. It doesn't matter if you do or not, but just breathe, right? Breathe, take deep breaths, calm yourself down. It doesn't mean that you all of the sudden going to have this like huge motivation, like, yeah, I want to go and do it. Right. But tiny like micro micro steps and you know,
Let's just say to yourself, I understand. I always talk with my nervous system, right? This person inside of me, right? So I always say, I know that this reaction is you trying to protect me. Okay? And I understand it. The compassion, right? The more compassion you can pour towards the situation, the better. And then from there you can go, I want to do this. I want to do this for me. I know it's scary.
Thank you for protecting me. Thank you for wanting to keep me safe, but I've got this, right? Because you have to, what happens on that situation when you open the door to your garage, your emotional brain takes over. let's, so what we have to do is the logical, because on the logical level, like, you know, you're grown up, like, you know, that this is good for you. You know, that you want to do it, right? But there is just this like,
This invisible force, right? That's what happens. So calm yourself down, speak to yourself. You know, it doesn't have to be loud. You can just like do it in your head. and just, that would be the first thing that I would do. And if, if, the garage or the space produces a really high level of anxiety, I would actually focus for the next like five to seven days, just doing this one thing.
Speaker 1 (16:34)
Right.
Speaker 2 (16:35)
Right. Because here's the thing. If you don't tackle your garage at all, like it's still messy. So what's the difference if you're going to wait another seven days or five days to just calm your nervous system down a little bit. Right. There is literally like, like no one's rushing you. No one's, you know, there behind you, forcing you to do it. Right. It's just.
We put those imaginary timelines on ourselves because we think like, have to get it done today. So I would really focus on this for the next few days. But if you feel after one time, if you feel like, okay, I think I can go and do it. Then the next step is have a look around and choose the simplest thing that you can do. The smallest, the easiest thing. And there is just this one.
beautiful category of items that we all have in every single space. I would hazard a guess that we all have it in every single space in our home. Do you want to guess what that could be?
Speaker 1 (17:38)
Yes, but like as you say, I'm like a total blank.
Speaker 2 (17:41)
my gosh, what is it, right? Okay, I'm going to blow your mind and you're going to say like, no, you didn't say that it's trash.
Speaker 1 (17:43)
Yes!
Okay, see that's not coming into my head. Cause I was like going through, you know, all of the different things that are cluttering and what, know, trash. Yes. ⁓
Speaker 2 (17:59)
have it, like we don't realize until we open, because here's the thing with clutter, we become blind to it because we've, it surrounds us so much that, you know, we just like sort of ignore it. have to, because otherwise, if you think about it, like we take on like 11 million bits of data every minute of every day. So some of this has to be filtered out because we just go mad. Right. And the clutter, because it's there.
It's like with the scent, right? You put a nice perfume, you smell it for five minutes and then you don't smell it anymore. It sort of disappears, right? So it's the same here. And trash is, if you really like open your eyes just to look for trash, it also takes away the pressure from having to deal with, you know, those harder things, right? I'm not saying go and declutter your wedding dress straight away or like go into your, you know, your baby. ⁓
baby clothes or stuff like that. Right? Just know the easiest way. Here's the thing with trash because it all again, nervous system and also the brain science. You have proof throughout your entire life. I hope that you have gotten rid of trash before. Right? So it's not that it's new, right? There is zero emotional attachment to trash. Right? And we're not talking about like
you know, extreme holders here, because that's a completely different situation. That's a completely different conversation. But for sort of like an normal level of clutter, or even like extreme but not to the hoarding level, like we all have like you, I promise you, you open any drawer in your house, there's an there will be trash or trash like item, right? Maybe a pen that doesn't work anymore, or something broken, right? And
those easy decisions, it's exactly like, know, when you go to the gym, right? First time, you want to train to run a marathon. Do you go on the day one and run like a hundred mile, you know, those extreme super marathons? You don't, right? You do a little run here, then another one, then another one. And, you know, if you want to go, if you go to the gym and build muscles, you don't just bench like 200 pounds straight away, right? Cause you'd break yourself. It's the same here. You have to...
Teach yourself that you can do it and actually that you are the person who does it. That is a huge difference here.
Speaker 1 (20:29)
huge, that is a huge idea right there. You are the person that does it. And I think, and it's so interesting as you talk, because when I go through and we, you know, go through to clean my kids' rooms, that level of clutter does not trigger me at all. And the first thing I do is give them each a trash bag and go in and get rid of all of the trash because especially my daughter, she's big into art. There's always like bits of paper all around her desk that, you know, she's done stuff.
So that's an easy first sweep.
Speaker 2 (20:59)
Yes.
Speaker 1 (21:01)
across
the store, there's not the thought of like, let's take a trash bag and go get, and I know there's trash in there. I know there's cycling because there's, you know, boxes that got thrown in there that were supposed to be taken to the recycling bin and then they just never got there. And that's an easy first step. And it's interesting when you break it down, how I can see I'm breaking it down in other areas of my life, but this one particular space is an all or nothing.
I don't have a whole day to dedicate to the garage, so I'm not going to go do it, where I could just grab a bag, go pick up the trash that's there, get the recycling out, and it would make a dent.
Speaker 2 (21:42)
It would, and not only, know, maybe like visibly, so here's the thing. When I started decluttering, I worked 15 hours a day. Right. So to anyone who says I don't have time, like I am the living proof that it doesn't matter how much time you actually have. I started with one minute. So for a solid month, I did only one minute. And after a week, I already was able to, and I set the timer as well.
So after a week, I was already able to see results, but here's the thing. Now, the more I think about this, one minute, right, is maybe the results were not someone who would come in from like outside after like a week, they would maybe they wouldn't maybe notice what I was noticing. But I think I was not only noticing the tangible thing that was there, but also how
I think it was more about the confidence that I did it. I wasn't passive anymore. I wasn't a victim anymore. I wasn't lamenting that my life is so bad because I have all that clutter that's moving in my life. I was actually taking steps and every single time when I looked at those spaces that there was no ice cream containers,
empty ice cream containers anymore or dirty dishes anymore, lying around. And I could see that difference. So with the garage, it's, you know, exactly what you said, you go in there with the assumption, whether you realize that or not, but you go there with the assumption of it has to be done in one go. Right. And it's never going to be done in one go.
Speaker 1 (23:26)
Yes.
Speaker 2 (23:30)
Because it's not really here with a particularly, if you have a history of re-cluttering your garage, no matter what house you are in, you have also a history of getting rid of stuff from that garage because you moved houses. So I'm assuming you didn't leave all the stuff in the previous houses, right? In the garages.
Speaker 1 (23:50)
Sometimes I wish I could have, but no. Yes!
Speaker 2 (23:52)
Yeah, but with this one, it's like, you know, there is, we can go really, really deep into like the reasons why. And I think the action, especially in the beginning, is more powerful than finding out and figuring out like, where is it all coming from and why Garrett? And why do I have to, why do I have a need to like fill it up to the brim every single time? But
Yeah, trash, because I've never been in your house. I've never been in every single house in the whole world, but I guarantee that there is clutter in every single house. Sorry, mess as in rubbish in every single house that we don't even see.
Speaker 1 (24:30)
Yes. As I go through my house and I'm like, and there are rooms in my house that I would say are clean, but there are, there are drawers in probably every room that has that, ⁓ I don't even want to deal with that, that, you know, the pen that doesn't quite work right. So, but you still throw it in the drawer instead of throwing it in the trash. Yeah. Like all of those little things do add up. And I love how you bring in doing it for a minute every day.
because we're building that habit of success. I did it for a minute. I survived the minute. I'm okay. I'm safe. And we're starting to create that pattern. And it's like, as you're talking, I think about all of the different patterns that I have in my life, like doing dishes at night. You know, there's certain routines that we kind of clean up the kitchen, especially after dinner, so that it doesn't have all that clutter. So we don't leave, you know, a ton of dirty dishes in the sink, but I'm not looking at that.
at using those little 60 minute patterns in other areas, how it doesn't take much, but it becomes that all or nothing belief system instead of, know, let's go through and do this once a week or do this every day. And those little moments of momentum that you're creating from that 60 seconds really does add up in
Speaker 2 (25:51)
Yeah,
it's like compounding. Yes, for sure, you know, but it's not only the visible because clutter at end of the day clutter. I always say to everyone, right, you don't really want to declutter your home. That's not your goal, right? You think that it is, right? Like, it's this like, you know, the tip of the iceberg, because that's what you see. But what do you really want is that freedom not to have to
think about it, not to have to have it on the to-do list every single time. And like you said, you know, it always goes down the list of priorities, right? Let's do it another time. And it's this weight that is dragging us down, you know, that mental weight that we have, right? That overload, but also, know, clutter causes so many things that in our life that happen, right? So for example, you know, maybe you
accidentally shout at you. did actually on my Amazon speaker. I don't want to say her name because she's going to start talking now, but I remember one day, you know, I was walking up the stairs and the alarm was going off and she didn't hear me the first time. She didn't hear me the second time. Just, you know, I was just saying her name and stop. And I just started shouting, right. And it was because I was exhausted. was tired. I've had enough. And it was just like,
my gosh, I shouted at this poor speaker for no reason because the weight of everything was just too heavy. Right. So you don't really want like decluttering is just like it's a tool that's going to change your life for sure. But but there is just so much that's going on underneath it that it can be quite deep for sure.
Speaker 1 (27:33)
Absolutely. I love how you described it as heavy because it is, there is that weight that yes, the visual aspect of I like to look at my kitchen and not have things on the countertops. And I like to go in my living room and not have it, you know, a complete disaster. Those are two areas I really do like to have tidy in my own home for my own mental health space. But there is that heavy weight of, you know, what's in the drawers.
what's in the cover, what's in the cover is crazy and how decluttering can help lift some of that load because there are so many things that are also weighing down on us throughout life.
Speaker 2 (28:05)
The load is crazy.
Yeah. Yeah. You know, for all the people pleasers out there listening, right? First of all, I love you. I see you recovering people, please hear myself, but decluttering actually helped me massively to recover from that. And it's just crazy. know, it's, all about people pleasing is like, have no boundaries, right? There was literally no boundaries whatsoever. Just like sort of in a, in one sentence to just sum it up and what
decluttering helped me realize is... So here's the thing. When I started decluttering, I felt this bravery inside of me just rising and rising and rising, just coming to the surface. Why? Because every single time I decluttered something that was at that time, now it's just silly things like candles and, you know, half-burned candles. And I really struggled letting go of things like that.
But every single time where I pushed my nervous system to expand, to hold those decisions. And when I decluttered something, something more meaningful at a time, like no one came to shout at me, right? The piano that didn't drop from the sky and killed me. The tornado didn't take my house. Nothing happened. So that gave me more and more and more confidence. And then
I remember like I was dating this new guy at the time. And as a people pleaser, I always dated the same, like the five versions of the same guy, right? Just different face and a different name and a different address. Yeah. and I was always like the chauffeur there, you know, the P the person who would do everything around the relationship. Right. And I remember I was like, Ooh, maybe if I.
like I'm feeling brave here now I've decluttered like I've decluttered the candle that I kept for like three years. I'm feeling great. So we were like talking about a date and I just messaged him okay just let me know. And like my heart froze at that moment because he was like my hands were shaking and he messaged me back saying I'll pick you up at seven on Saturday. And I'm like what what just like it blew my mind and
I truly, truly believe that it was because I built that confidence with, know, clutter that was, and to be honest, I built that confidence with trash, like with getting rid of trash. So it's definitely, it has a ripple effect and now I'm here and I wouldn't be here if I hadn't done it. So it definitely has a huge effect.
Speaker 1 (30:51)
It does. And I love how, like, just as you're talking about the half-use candles, I'm like, but... And I come from, you know, like, definitely that my dad was somebody that we're gonna save it because I'm gonna use it someday for something. So I know that there are those stories in my head where that candle came up and I'm like, but it's half done. And I might need that candle to...
Speaker 2 (31:12)
Even though
I hate the smell, it makes me cough every time I burn it, right?
Speaker 1 (31:16)
But I might need it someday, so you know, might as well keep it in the garage, which is probably why our garage is a little bit cut, a little bit, lot of it. My husband also comes from that thought pattern. So, you know, there's a little bit of that. Well, we'll keep it because you never know.
Speaker 2 (31:32)
Yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1 (31:33)
So I wanna shift because I hear the little bits and all of the momentum we can start gaining as we start to declutter and the confidence that we get as we start to declutter. But one of the things that I have found is that once I declutter, it comes back. So I work through the bravery or I push through and just turn off the body signals and I get rid of a bunch of stuff and very rarely do I ever regret.
anything that I have given away, know, or thrown away or repurposed. You're right. There is a lot of that, you know, nothing happens when you do that. But then it creeps back. How do we declutter and keep it lasting?
Speaker 2 (32:17)
Ooh, that's my favorite topic. Like I live for this topic. So, okay. Decluttering alone is not going to be enough. ⁓ Because like you said, you bring stuff into your home, right? So here's the thing, what trips many people up is you'll go to a shop, right? And like you, like you in the shopping center, like on the website, and then you see like sell like huge sell side, right?
Speaker 1 (32:20)
I'm
Great.
Speaker 2 (32:43)
this urge of needing to go in and buy stuff that you haven't even like thought about twice before. And then you like buy all of those things and then we struggle to let go of the things that we actually didn't even, it didn't even cross our mind to buy it. We just sort of impulse buy it, right? So it's a big thing here. It's not only like decluttering, but actually working with those shopping habits.
And, and really here with this one, there is a lot of journaling needed. A lot of like internal, yes. Can you do it all by yourself? I think, I think it's going to be quite challenging to rewire those shopping habits. The, the reasons why we bring stuff, because it's not only stuff that we buy, but also
Again, people pleasing because we keep gifts that we don't like.
Speaker 1 (33:38)
Yes. That's a, huh. The, Of like telling my in-laws, no, please don't bring another box of books from my husband's childhood because there's a bunch of them in our garage that we never even look at. There is that people pleasing and the holding the boundaries and then those receiving where it feels like, I can't get rid of those boxes of books because
Speaker 2 (33:39)
Guilty? Yeah, so-
Speaker 1 (34:03)
You know, they came from my husband's childhood, even though he's never opened the box of Steve and see what's in there.
Speaker 2 (34:09)
They're not even yours, right? But you feel guilty for letting him go? Absolutely!
Speaker 1 (34:13)
So I can just knock them. Trying to get him to come in with me. And because he's also having the, you know, the resistance to cleaning out the garage. All of the different layers that are coming in. So you talked about shifting our shopping habits, being more conscious, which will help us in our wealth as well as we're not just going
Speaker 2 (34:33)
10
%? Yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:35)
at those unconscious buys because I think that is such a huge thing. And for me, a lot of it was unconscious buys for my kiddos and like, you know, we're out somewhere and all the vacation junk that you pick up because they need a souvenir from whatever really shifting that consciously just because I was like more in that wealth thought. I don't want to just be wasting my money. Let's put it to something that we really want, but how it also was decluttering.
Because as we're it, we've broken that habit of our kids, like every time we go somewhere, I need the souvenir from this, also has less stuff in our house.
Speaker 2 (35:13)
Yeah, because you declutter before it even enters your house.
Speaker 1 (35:17)
But it has an unconscious thought of that's what we're doing. So if we look at our shopping habits, what else can we do to kind of keep that lasting effect of decluttering?
Speaker 2 (35:28)
Definitely, you know, people think of decluttering as something that they do once. But I want to like break everyone best everyone's bubble here. You are going to be decluttering until your last day on earth. Right. I know it's a bummer. Right. Because here's the thing.
Speaker 1 (35:46)
I just won't have a clean house that stays clean all the time when my kids leave. Like that's my thought.
Speaker 2 (35:52)
As long as you never, ever, ever change your habits, as long as you never, ever bring anything into your home, as long as you never grow out of the stuff that you like, then yeah, it's going to stay exactly as it is. But it's not possible because, you know, the mail comes in, right? The gifts come in. You know, I think of clutter not as items,
things that we have like books, CDs, DVDs, whatever, clothes, those things, but actually every single thing. So trash for me is also clutter, right? Every single thing. so in that sense, yeah, you will always be cleaning and decluttering always, always, always. But the sooner we realize that, I think it shifts something in like this sort of lever gets like switched and
in our head and being okay that this is just what it is. You're always going to need clean clothes, so the laundry is going to always happen. And it's the same with decluttering. If you kept every single piece of clothing that you've ever had, I don't think there is enough closet space in any of the houses to fill that, to keep that. So that's kind of...
breaking point to a lot of people like this aha moment, I would say maybe to a lot of people. But definitely with the shopping, here's the thing, the more you declutter, the more you... Okay. I've got a golden nugget here. Just had a download. When, once you taste of that freedom of getting rid of stuff and how it feels, you will forever be changed and you will always...
seek out that feeling. Right. So I'm not actually too much worried about people who decluttered in a nervous system regulated way. Because even if clutter creeps back a little bit, right. Because again, like we bring stuff in, but because we are regulated, we've expanded our capacity to hold a cleaner and tidier space. We don't default back all the way to the mess. And even if we do,
You know how to deal with it because you've done it before and it is safe to your nervous system to do it. So even if you don't touch any of the items for like five years and then in five years you accumulate loads, you know, you sort of snap back from it because it's okay to bring stuff in. You snap back from it and you go, okay, let me just pull my sleeves up and get to work. And once you have that taste of that freedom, you're like,
You're gonna be chasing it forever.
Speaker 1 (38:39)
makes so much sense in all of my little- Yes, right? Yes, of like, I have cluttering or decluttering as a, an event that I do. Once you're tagging into, okay, so this is like laundry. This is like doing the dishes. These are routines that we now have in place instead of a one time I'm going through and decluttering my house every year or every six months or when we move and I have to.
Speaker 2 (38:50)
Mmm. Yep.
Speaker 1 (39:08)
that it's a continual process and that.
Speaker 2 (39:10)
because otherwise it's too taxing, it's too much. And you won't even notice that you're doing it, right? You're just like, ⁓ okay, let me just throw that thing away.
Speaker 1 (39:22)
Yes, and then there's that safety in and the safety and the habit and the routine in that this is something that we know how to do is in throwing that away. That it doesn't become this like, do I keep the pen? I hate the pen, but it still works, but I hate it. Do I keep it? Yep, I put it back in the drawer, which increases the clutter. It's, don't like that candle. I'm gonna get rid of it. And the events going through of like,
Speaker 2 (39:48)
Exactly. Easy.
Speaker 1 (39:52)
my gosh, but I got to keep it because you know, my sister gave it to me and no, just get rid of it. Yeah. There's permission in that and power in that. And the daily thing and I have the power to choose to get rid of it. I see now how you're saying that really helped me recover from people pleasing behaviors because there is that power and yeah, somebody gave it to me and I'm still going to get rid of it and be okay.
Speaker 2 (40:04)
Oshkala.
Yeah. And you know, what's, I think what's important here to also mention is that do not, do not expect yourself for all of this, what we are talking about today to happen overnight, right? Because it is a process. So permission to take it as slow as possible. It's actually funny, like the other day I was speaking with my business coach, right? And we were talking about like an offer that I want to put out and she was like, okay, what is the timeframe that you can like promise to people, you know, like
in seven days, like, because these are like very catchy things in like online world, right? In the digital product. And I was like, no, I, my, my whole thing is take as long as you possibly need, um, not to like extend it, but do it in a way that it feels safe for you because those imaginary, um, timelines, it's different when you're like moving houses because you have a deadline. That's different story, but
those imaginary timelines, like I have to be done by seven days. And if you are not, so much shame, so much like this inner criticism, because like, you know, you all of the sudden feel like a failure that you haven't been able to do it because Susan down the road, declared at her house in six months and you are like a year in and still sort of baby stepping through the mess. It's OK. Like you have all the time in the world to do it.
And, you know, the more consistent you are, those one minutes will turn into two minutes in five, 10 minutes, 15 minutes. I don't really suggest doing more because we have lives to live. Right. Yeah, 100%. 10 minutes is 10 minutes is enough. 10 minutes. Imagine doing it 10 minutes. Actually, if you do five minutes every day for a whole year.
Speaker 1 (41:59)
Mission 15.
Speaker 2 (42:13)
You will, by the end of the year, you will have decluttered for 33 hours. Wow. Imagine sitting down and doing 33 hours in one go. Nobody has time for that, but 33 hours of decluttering, that's like a huge progress, right? Five minutes a day. Double that and you double the, it's 66 hours. Right. So, but here's the thing, right? The way I teach decluttering is.
Speaker 1 (42:32)
Yes.
Speaker 2 (42:42)
Because we are sort of focusing on a fast regulation, that's easy. 10 seconds done. Right. And then the easiest things, trash, and then moving through those category of items that are like the easiest. If you have to think about an item, like let's say I have this like hair bun, right. And if I have to like think about it, like what do I do with it? Like, do I declutter? I keep, mm-mm, skip it. You're not ready, right?
your nervous system is not expanded enough to hold that decision, right? Because you either going to regret getting rid of it because you're not ready or you're going to, maybe you'll get rid of it and there will be a little bit of this like euphoria and then it will give you the bravery, but more often than not, it will freeze you, right? So it's better to skip it and do sort of do rounds in your home. Go around,
Just focus on trash, right? And do it like, I don't know, every day for seven days, depending on how big your house is and how much clutter you have. Do it for 30 days, for two months every day, because I guarantee the second time when you come back to the same space, you will see something that you haven't seen before. Yes. Right? Permission to take it slow.
Speaker 1 (44:04)
I love that permission to take it slow because that is shifting everything as I'm thinking about, okay, so I can go out and work for 10 minutes, you know, and pick up trash and then pick up the next easy things. And I love how you said if you have to debate it, put it back. You're not ready. No, because that's where you get, or I personally get stuck is that like, ⁓ that debate. And do I keep it? Do I not, do I do that? And then I spent so much time and energy trying to beat that. And then I give up.
Speaker 2 (44:32)
Yeah. Yeah. And then you feel like a felon, you were not able to decide whether this like stupid hairband, this, you know, deserves to stay in your house or should you like let it go? Right. So there is no need to make yourself feel bad because decisions are hard. Decisions are going to be hard. But the more you work to expand your capacity to make those decisions, the easier it be.
Speaker 1 (45:00)
That makes so much sense. Cause as I visualize myself kind of sweeping through my house and you take the one and get everything is super easy, all the trash, but then going through it and the next time through, you're going to see just because you have the capacity. Now you have grown your ability to throw things away, to give things away, to repurpose things. And then you get to see things in a different light. And it's like, ⁓ well that now was hard, but became easy. And that can go in the second round through.
And then more and more gets to go through and it doesn't become this big giant where, you know, cleaning out the entire closet or the entire garage and really putting a lot of time and effort into this. just gets, see how you're growing your capacity.
Speaker 2 (45:43)
Yeah. And it becomes, I always say decluttering and, ⁓ you know, effortless decluttering. And that's what it becomes when you reach that point, however long it's going to take you. It's okay. Right. It's okay. but you will reach it there. You will reach that point and maybe eventually, and here's the thing, a lot of people say like, but how do I go through books or those difficult things? How do I, you know, do I keep my wedding dress or get rid of it? And, like,
whatever other difficult items there are. And my question is always, but why do you want to get rid of it? Like what's the actual reason that you want to get rid of it? Is it because everyone else does it? Is it because the Susan down the road said that she decluttered her, her wedding dress, and now you think that you should as well? Like what is the standard? Like who said that standard? Because here's the thing, there is no rules. There is no rules.
Like you get to decide, you are the author and creator of your own life. You get to decide what stays, what goes, whether you want to keep 20 towels or one, right? I have one, my mom has 20. Right? It doesn't matter. Right? There is no rules.
Speaker 1 (46:55)
there's no rules because I think a lot of us were trying to think through, know, do we keep the baby clothes? Well, why would we keep the baby clothes? It's not like, I mean, there's a sentimental value. But at the same time, like I'm never going to reuse those baby clothes. And honestly, my kids are not going to put their kids, you know, 20 years down the line in those baby clothes. Those can go really easily as I'm thinking through it. But the wedding dress, yes, I want to keep that because.
Speaker 2 (47:23)
And keep it, of course.
Speaker 1 (47:25)
More than I
Speaker 2 (47:27)
Exactly.
100 % permission to keep everything that is hard or even if it's not like a flick of the wrist decision, keep it. Because what we just talked about is the more times you like go around your house, around your house, around your house, eventually you will go back to that wedding dress and you'll be like, sorry, see you later. Right? There will be literally like not even a...
hesitation or maybe you'll never get rid of it. Maybe you will just keep it, know, maybe you will be buried in it. I don't know.
Speaker 1 (48:05)
Right?
Speaker 2 (48:06)
So you expand your capacity and if it's hard to decide, if it's not a flick of the wrist decision, skip it.
Speaker 1 (48:15)
That is so huge.
Speaker 2 (48:17)
Mm. It's life changing.
Speaker 1 (48:19)
It is life-changing and this conversation can apply to so many different areas of our life, not just decluttering. So you have such incredibly wise words. As we are coming to a close, is there anything else that you would like to share before we're done?
Speaker 2 (48:36)
I think just one thing, and I think we briefly talked about it, but I really want to make a point of A, there is no rules and B, drop the expectations because we have the expectation of it's going to take me three months and now my house will be done, right? Or six months. And then when it doesn't happen, the shame, the judgment, you know, all those like big negative emotions come in. So drop their expectations and just love the process.
the power is in the process and make yourself feel good, find those good feeling thoughts in the process. That's going to speed it up massively.
Speaker 1 (49:16)
Yes, that's so incredible. Find the good feeling thoughts in the process. You're amazing. is the incredible conversation that is literally taking place in this moment. I know there are other people that are resonating so deeply with what you're saying. How can people continue the conversation and connect with you?
Speaker 2 (49:21)
Yeah.
So I am on Instagram, so I welcome everyone to come follow me and Dorota called the decluttering. That's D-O-R-O-T-A-K-U-L-D-O decluttering. I'm sure you put the link in the show notes as well. Yeah, come say hello. There is so much, like there's just so much happening on my Instagram. Everyone will find something, a little nuggets here and there, useful resources and things like that.
Speaker 1 (50:07)
Gosh, I love that. I'm going to go over and follow you if I haven't already. this is so much fun. Thank you so much for this conversation and your wise, wise words.
Speaker 2 (50:16)
Thank you so much for having me. I enjoyed it immensely.
Landy Peek (50:19)
what an incredible conversation. What I am taking away from this conversation is simple and powerful. There are no rules and you're allowed to go slow. And I think we can take that from more than just decluttering our own house to our lives as well.
one minute counts, picking up trash, a single bag of recycling. Each tiny compassionate decision tells our nervous system that we're safe. And that is how real change sticks.
If today's episode resonated, try it. Open one drawer, take a look for only trash, breathe, stop a minute, support your nervous system in the way that you have found helps it. Music, tools, techniques, and then notice how your body feels. That's momentum.
I want to thank you for being here. I am so grateful that you are here, that you are listening, that you are doing things that change your life. You are an incredible human being. And just know by you showing up.
every day you are changing people's lives. This is Landi Peek and I will talk to you on the next episode.
Speaker 2 (51:36)
Hey, before you go, just a little bit of legal. This podcast is designed for educational purposes only. It is not to replace any expert advice from your doctors, therapists, coaches, or any other professional that you would work with. It's just a chat with a friend, me, where we get curious about ideas, thoughts, and things that are going on in our lives.
As we're talking about friends, if you know someone who would benefit from a conversation today, please share because I think the more that we open up these conversations, the more benefit we all get. So until next time, give yourself a big hug from me and stay curious because that's the fun in this world.
